Monday, December 19, 2011

The prophets on the women and the men who supported immoral women.

Not too happy someone commenting here is defending prostitution as an "outlet for sexual lust". He is married but what else is new.

The biggest issue is just the selfish focus on your most base desires that only really benefit this selfish man.

I thought I would quote Issiah in his criticism of the Israel at that time.

Issiah 3:12 My people's rulers are babes it is governed by women. O my people your leaders are misleaders they have confused the course of your paths

3.13. The Lord stands to plead a cause he rises to champion peoples

14.  the Lord will bring the charge against the elders and officers of his people. It is you who have ravaged the vineyard that which was robbed from the poor is in your houses.

15. How dare you crush my people and grind the faces of the poor? say my Lord God of Hosts.

16 The Lord said: because the daughters of Zion are so vain and walk with heads thrown back with roving eyes and with mincing gait making a tinkling with their feet My lord will bare the pates of the daughters of Zion the lord will uncover their heads.

  So what is the connection here between oppressing the poor and criticizing the women for being haughty and vain and the men for being ruled by women who obviously they would do anything for the women because of their lusts.

  I think the answer is pretty obvious in that the men oppressed other men so they can satisfy everything their wife wanted. And even unmarried women they liked to make happy as well. This of course makes it harder for those poor and unmarried and interestingly at least in today's time unmarried men actually only make 85% of what unmarried women and being married does help a man in some ways as well although obviosuly a man has to have a job which of course men that aren't ruled by their lusts would help another be able to make some kind of living that would help him support a wife although work is not suppose to be easy or fun.

  When a man is focused on his lusts however he will not do anything to help the other man that could use a break and instead try to keep other men down so he can have more pleasure while another man has nothing At the end of the day the women who do this as well God does not look kindly upon as this passage suggests the women for their behavior and being part of enjoying to have men that are poor and helpless. .

  I myself do try to look at the bigger picture and at my last job in a large office I always to help another guy with what I know (if they wanted it ) as I don't feel it is a win-lose situation. And sadly there are sick men that actually find this to be wrong as you should never help the other guy. Which is just not right to want the other guy to have as few skills as possible and some hide behind "equality for women" when it is really about their own lusts. Anyway, got to go back to work now as I have a lot to do today.


fschmidt said...

Analytical Adam, are you calling me selfish? I don't understand. I don't want prostitution for myself. I want it to protect my wife and daughter from unnecessary sexual advances. Is that selfish?

"When a man is focused on his lusts however he will not do anything to help the other man that could use a break and instead try to keep other men down so he can have more pleasure while another man has nothing"

This I fully agree with, and this is why prostitution is so badly needed as a sexual outlet. Most men who are deprived of sex become obsessed with it. American men are the most sex-obsessed men on earth for just this reason, because prostitution is illegal here. Why is this so hard for you to understand?

Analytical Adam said...

Huh? So you want prostitution for other men but not for you. I have to be honest with you. I find this impossible to believe because first of all ok I will admit it I am a virgin and even if a woman is attractive in my own mind I would be hurting another man who did nothing to me by being interested in a woman that is married and I wouldn't want that done to myself and in general that keeps me honest as I have been treated badly at times in my life and I don't want other to be treated badly.

I don't feel the need for prostitutes because I don't have sexual intimacy with a woman at this time. I find it a violation of what God created a woman for and it wasn't just for a man's sexual pleasures.

But my biggest argument is that most men who feel they have to act on any lust that when they have when they act on it usually has the opposite effect in that they become more of a sex addict. Sad to say I once spent a Shabboth with a Jewish men who liked to have casual sexual relations with women and by doing this he become more of someone that just use women as for his own pleasure not less.

I find it hard to believe that you are so not astute of how other men behave and what prostitution actually does to a man which is the opposite you claim as it makes more likely to give in to his lusts the next time.

Among women as well. I had a woman on facebook that felt the second they want intimacy they should get it and if not it is grounds for divorce because she control this process. Which is absurd.

Analytical Adam said...

Part 2: On part I I expressed my personal experiences not I am gong to go to some biblical reasons why this is really disgusting what you are saying. I may lose you as someone that comments but that is ok I'll get other.

First of all, God created a woman to be the man's helpmate. Having enough life experience no matter how much women try they do like this and enjoy being the helpmate of some man and as much as they try to do other things it doesn't satisfy them. I don't think that makes them a doormat in fact they need a man that is honest and open.
Genesis 2:20. Being a prostitute doesn't let that fill that role which needs no further explanation.

Furthermore, in Exodus 21 it also mentions that if a woman is sold due to poverty to a man and the man ends up finding her not to his liking he can't sell her like he would a man.

And in Deutoronomy 21 when a man takes a women captive during a war (which is the one case God understands that being in a war in that state a man's desires are at a level you can't completely suppress it) God does NOT allow a man to just have relations with her. He has to let her mourn her parents for 30 days and if he decides that she wouldn't make a good wife he has to let her go and can't make money from selling her to someone else.

If this is the case here when a man is in a war and likely very deprived how can you claim it is ok in a normal day to day situation.
Clearly God recognizes certain vulnerabilities women have that men don't.

And God unlike with a man in both these cases the man can't sell her for money which I think God is aware of a woman's nature and not to take advantage of her because her father is poor or dead and take advantage of her nature to be the helpmate of a man when she if vulnerable and doesn't have a father to be there for her if another man treats her badly.

Being a prostitute is a complete violation of a woman's nature.

And there are so many men who are not married and you are more concerned about prostitutes because you think that will protect your wife and daughter (which I don't buy it) then the fact that if more women are prostitutes there are less women available for OTHER MEN to marry. So yes I do think you are very selfish and very twisted.

I also hope your wife isn't one who wants other women to be prostitutes because she doesn't other women to be happy in a marriage because you're marriage isn't so great so she agrees with you and supports your sick ideas because she wants to keep other women down.

fschmidt said...

I am married now so I don't need prostitutes. When I was single, I did go to prostitutes regularly. This is entirely different from that Jewish man who chased women for sex. If a man chases women for sex, he must become obsessed with this because that is the only way to become good at this skill. Thankfully I never did this. How many men do you know who go to prostitutes for sex instead of chasing women? I bet none, but if you did know any, I would bet that such men would be stable and not into using women.

I respect your choice to remain a virgin. But this isn't for everyone. I found my wife at 28. If I hadn't had prostitutes as a sexual outlet, I would have snapped before then. Every sane culture in history has had prostitution as a sexual outlet, including Jewish culture.

fschmidt said...

My Part 2:

A good prostitute is a sort of temporary help-mate for hire. Also, based on your logic, a woman should be forced into marriage even if she wants to remain single. Is that what you are saying?

Women shouldn't just be bought and sold against their will as slaves. That is fully consistent with my view.

Same applies to female captives of war.

Men at war at those times were very unlikely to have been sexually deprived. The wars were short and prostitutes were plentiful.

"the fact that if more women are prostitutes there are less women available for OTHER MEN to marry."

Your constant repeating of this statement doesn't make it true and in fact it is completely false. An adequate supply of prostitutes protects the chastity of other women making more women available for marriage. That is why I went from a society deficient in prostitutes (America) to a country with an adequate supply of prostitutes (Mexico) to find a wife. There are really only 3 options for a society. Either people marry very young, or prostitutes must be readily available, or the vast majority of the women will become sluts (as in America).

"your sick ideas"

Analytical Adam, you seem to disagree with a lot of people. I don't call you "sick" just because you don't agree with me. This is the kind of behavior that I am used to seeing from liberals and feminists. As a non-liberal Jew, you should be able to respectfully disagree.

Analytical Adam said...

fschmidt wrote:>An adequate supply of prostitutes protects the chastity of other women making more women available for marriage.<

It is completely illogical what you are saying since these women who are prostitutes are NOT ELIGIBLE FOR MARRIAGE.

fschmidt wrote:> Also, based on your logic, a woman should be forced into marriage even if she wants to remain single. Is that what you are saying?<

Actually, yes. Any healthy society pushes women to get married and not remain single. The only people that benefit from single woman are men that want to take advantage of them being single which of course they can be prostitutes. That is why in our society a married women has Mrs. by her name like here in the US. Most societies understand (until they become corrupted) that their society needs women to get married and yes it should be encouraged.

You're logic is against all reason because giving in to base desires for its own sake will just to less self control in the future and believing you have to act on any lust or base desire.

Analytical Adam said...

And yes I do find your idea's to be twisted. The idea that women become sluts because there are no prostitutes. It makes no sense. And the biggest thing is most prostitutes are of child bearing age they can get pregnant and have other problems with having multiples sex partners.

God created animals that they do have sex when it is likely to create a female animal to get pregnant. If men act like this they are lower then animals.

You are so focused on men being able to fulfill their lusts that you are being irrational in the fact that it is harmful to many women and does take many women out of the marriage market.

And most of all clearly from what I can see the bible does find this very wrong and a misuse of sexuality and something certainly that shouldn't go on in the holy land of Israel. That is for sure. But any sane country would follow this lead in the bible as well.

The bible will not an ideal did allow polygamy so in certain situations a woman could get married if the alternative was to marry an evil man since women do have a biological clock.

Being a prostitute in no way fulfills a woman in any emotional way.

So I am upset and disgusted that you would support this kind of immorality when there is no example in the bible of any good man visiting prostitutes.

In fact the fact that you visited prostitutes when you are younger has completely twisted you own thinking into something that no rational person not ruled by their base desires would think makes any sense.

Prostitution stop slutty behavior and keep other women virtuous. That is absurd.

Anonymous said...

Dear Adam. This is an old -and very long!! - conversation (started more than 2yrs ago) but as I just ran across it, wanted to support your reasoning. Yes. I am responding on Shabbat! I found this post while researching Is. 3:17 re. God uncovering the heads of women for taunting men with their looks and adornment. If God finds this so wrong that He Himself would reach down from heaven to smite her, how much more offensive is it for her to lay naked and perform the most sacred and private act reserved only for a husband, with another man (or woman!), how is there any justification for prostitution? I'm with you!! I know you're tired of hearing, be patient, Good has a woman for you... but He does. And it's not just any woman. And was proposed just for you. World you want a wide just to have a wife, and miss out on what God has saved as the best of the best - just for you? I've been divorced for 39 years and am still waiting... I can't wait to see what my Father has saved for me!!!

Adam K said...

Well thanks.

We are suppose to do what we have to do and have other help us.

I am 40 (going to be 41 in July) and we have to do what we have to do and at this point realistically I don't know what is gong to be.

This focus on just thinking things will work out that is not the way things are suppose to be done. You look at the men in the bible and they all tried to do something to meet a woman. Which is my biggest issue is that it is hard for me to be people and very few really set me up.