Wednesday, June 01, 2011
Paternal vs. Maternal Lineage. In general the torah views it by the father.(Part 2) Deutoronomy 7:1-5
Here is Part 1 of this discussion. Paternal vs. Maternal Lineage Part 1
Someone on a board that was discussing Maternal Lineage according to Rabbis (which their view is very suspect) mentions this passage in the Talmud. The more some of these issues are pushed by some (mostly those who are new to Rabbinic Judaism so they are naive and can be used easily) the more I realize that the reason for dong this had no real good intentions and really think people are stupid to just say things that anyone with a few brain cells can see makes no sense. Anyway, this was what this person quoted to try to prove Maternal Lineage based on Rabbis in the Talmud using biblical passages.
BT Mas. Kiddushin (68b)
“R. Yohanan said on the authority of R. Simeon b. Yohai, Because Scripture said (referring to Devarim 7,1-5), ‘For he will turn away your son from following Me...’: your son by an Israelite woman is called your son, but your son by a heathen is not called your son. Rabina said: This proves that your daughter's son by a non-Israelite is called your son
Sadly the Talmud and Rabbis in Rabbinic Judaism like many other religions tries sometimes to fit their agenda into the bible when clearly when they are saying makes no sense whatsoever to anyone who has a few brain cells operating.
This Talmudic passage is claiming that by saying it will turn your son away in 7:4 this is somehow implying only the son of an Israelite woman but a non-Israelite woman the kid wouldn't be your son.
A major problem about this is the fact that verse 7:3 the passage before this warns both men and women not to marry from the 7 nations around them because they will turn your son away. So if a man married a woman from these tribes it shouldn't matter since the son isn't your son according to the passage in the Talmud and should just say if a man marries from these nations your kid won't be considered an Israelite. Yet the Torah does warn men the danger of marrying a woman from these 7 nations that the mother may cause their children to worship other Gods so clearly this passage before concludes that the child will be your son if a man marries from these nations but may practice idolatry in the land which will cause God to be angry at the Israelite people.
The second problem is the complete illogical and random conclusion being reached here obviously to fit certain agendas the Rabbis in the Talmud obviously had. To claim that saying turning your sons heart away is someway secretly pointing to Maternal lineage in terms of being considered from the Israelite nation and if the mother is not an Israelite he is not your son is absurd.
So it is completely insane this Rabbinic position from these biblical passages in that A: The passage before is concerned about a woman marrying a man for these 7 nations and how it will affect your son which shows the torah considers it your son and B. To conclude being concerned about your sons heart being turned away is somehow secretly pointing to Maternal Lineage to determine if you are from the nation of Israel is just completely illogical to any person that has a few brain cells. If you read these passages to someone (Deutoronomy 7:1-5) and told them it somehow is supporting Maternal Lineage they would think you were out of your mind or had some agenda that was blinding you from thinking in a rational way.I don't see how any rational person of the Jewish people or anyone else for that matter can accept this either if they are taught to think and be rational.